14 de octubre de 2011
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Wilkie Collins
Quiénes somos
- EOIGoya_Inglés
- El Departamento de Inglés de a Escuela Oficial de Idiomas (EOI) "Goya" se suma con este proyecto de blog, con el blog de teatro y con su página de vídeos en YouTube a la explotación de las nuevas tecnologías como parte de la enseñanza de idiomas en la enseñanza pública en Madrid. Un cálido agradecimiento a CMF, sin cuya colaboración esto no sería posible.
Concurso 2007-08
436 comentarios:
«El más antiguo ‹Más antiguo 201 – 400 de 436 Más reciente› El más reciente»When I finshed reading last chapter, I was thinking that Marian is always thinking about the safe of her sister.
Fosco is showing his face, he is keeping an eye on the sisters. Marian knows it but sometime she forgets it and she feels good with his words.
Marian has never had a boyfriend and I think that this cause she to feel vulnerable with Fosco´s attitude.
If she doesn´t worry Laura and her would have some problem in the future.
Glo, her sister's safety..., sometimes.., this makes her feel vulnerable.., Laura and she..,
Revise the pronouns I is the subject so it appears always before the main verb and all the other prons that appear after the main verb are ME, I meam in that column, the possessive always appears when the prep of is part of the meaning.
The relationship between Laura and Marian is special, there is a link in which Marian is the more generous. It is very lucky to have a Marian, not many people have one, but there are such people.
I don't think that Marian is vulnerable with Fosco because she hasn't ever had a boyfriend, maybe she is not interested in men, not everybody is, think of nuns and such people, I think he is very clever and knows how to talk to her, she realises that she is impressed by him so she is not totally blind.
Anonimo, how can L+M live.., to smile at him.., what will the secret be?..,
No, I don't think Marian would ever end like Madame F, Marian is too clever for that, she realises the Count's ability and I don't think his wife does.
I agree that they must be having a terrible time, Marian was very brave to try and scape, at that time it was not easy! Also the conventionalisms were something very difficult to fight and the scandal too, so they have to do things carefully.
Anónimo, I see you are Laura,
Now you all have to go to EL MAS RECIENTE or you won't see your comments or mine ok? Apparently we are in another window behind the first...
Hello guys...I can´t watch the football match so I said to myself, I am going to post something on the blog. Well, after reading the last chapter from Marian´s narrative I notice to conceal Sir Percival´s secret is much more important to persuade Laura to sign the deeds. Given that, there might be a connection between Anne and Laura´s intheritance so this fact leads me to think what Anne knows might make the inheritance changes. Therefore, I think Anne is the Laura´s secret sister. We don´t know so much about Frederick Fairlie´s life.
See you!
Pablo 1A-F
I knew Mariam was very brave and she has courage, when she went to spy the Count and Sir percival, I have felt really nervous, I don´t know how finish this chapter, but anyway I thing the last letter which Mariam gave to the fired girl...is in Count´s hands, because he has started to speak about the letter with sir Percival.
I think essays has to be good, we can learn more and not to do the real essays of class bad, as I do make with bad marks.
Julian, is much more important than convincing..., might make the inheritance change.., Laura's secret sister..,
Well, a very sharp comment! I agree the secret is more important than the money, so you could have a point!
Now that we know the Real Madrid lost it must be very comforting for you not to have watched the match, considering they lost. My condolences
Pablo, I don't know how the chapter will fonish.., in the Count's hands (count is a common name or at least considered so)..., essays have to be good.., we can learn more and not do the essays badly as I do and get bad marks..,
Well but now you have written a good comment though you muddled it up a bit at the end.
I agree the Count has the letters or knows of their content, he is really a one off, terrible! Poor girls! How are they going to fight against all that plotting!
THROUGH THE PAGES 317 TO 338 YOU CAN SEE HOW WICKED AND SELF-SEEKING PERCIVAL AND COUNT FOSCO ARE, BUT AT THE SAME TIME WE CAN´T BUT ADMIRE MISS HALCOMBE.HER COURAGE TO INVESTIGATE THE BAD DEEDS OF THOSE TWO FELLOWS,RISKING HER SECURITY,SHOWS HOW BRAVE AND LOYAL TO HER SISTER SHE IS.
Julio, a wonderful comment! Well done. I couldn't agree more Marian is worthy of admiration, she fights a lost battle or nearly so.
Sir P and Fosco are monstrous, it is horrible to think what we can do to get money!!
Esperanza A1C
After reading the last chapter I would like to highlight the sentence where Marian says "Our endurance must end and our resistance must begin today. That mark is a weapon to strike him with. I may have to swear to it, at some future time".
I think this is a very important and advanced thougth for these times because by reporting their situation, she moves from a passive position to a fighting way. To me, Marian is an early example of a women rights fighter; she is not only protecting her sister, moreover, she wants to denounce Percival's behavior.
Esperanza A1C
After reading the last chapter I would like to higlight the sentence where Marian says "Our endurance must end and our resistance must begin today. That mark is a weapon to strike him with, I may have to swear to it, at some future time".
I think this is a very important and advanced thought for these times because by reporting their situation, she moves from a passive position to a fighting way. To me, Marian is an early example of a women rights fighter; she is not only protecting her sister, moreover she wants to denounce Percival's behavior.
To read how coldly SIR PERCIVAL and COUNT FOSCO speak about what they would gain with LAURA´S death socks me.Their only interest in life is money and you can see that they have no scruples in all their dealings
Esperanza, thank you for the quote, you are very right and you have written it very well too.
Marian is ready to pass from an active to a passive role, she realises that if they don't fight they are going to lose, it is the traditional role of the man and she is ready to take it.
Julio, it also shocked me to see how very coldly they spoke about somebody's death and how they would gain by it! They are really bad, Sir Percival says drop it, at the beginning but Fosco insists, he is really the worst of the two.
The last two chapters have been really exciting. Marian has been hiden and listening a chat between Fosco and Percival. Fosco has one target: the money, and he doesn´t mind how get it! He proposes to Percival if the short way to get the money is Laura´s death, why no kill her??? Finally we have seen what we supossed Fosco is totally evil.
I think that Marian´s conduct is normal, according to the situation. She loves her sister, she can´t bear the awful Laura´s conditions and she feels guilty about it. Maibe, nowadays we aren´t used to see brave and consistent people. I am surprised about Sir Percival and Fosco evilness, although I get bored with the same argument over and over again.
I can't see your comments, can anybody help with this? I don't know why the mas reciente doesn't appear!
Ah now it is ok, thank God!!
Laura, he doesn't mind how to get it.., that Fosco is totally evil.
Yes, we suspected it but so much as a murderer? And that is what he is, now what he said about the lake being the worst place for a murder makes sense and that he didn't know what virtue was. The fact that he is clever makes him doubly dangerous.
We are now also certain that Sir P does not care a straw about Laura, he says so himself, he shrinks from the murder but I suppose Fosco will convince him.
Mercedes, she can't bear Laura's awful conditions.
Today with the loss of values and the greed for money it is indeed difficult to see a conduct like Marian's. She is totally free from selfishness, she has devoted her life to somebody else and for ever, she is a one off.
Fosco and Sir P are already showing us how money was going to become so important, in the sense that they are ready to do anything to get it, even murder...
Can't see your comments, I wonder if you could help me find them
I have to do this so that the mas reciente appears, a bother.
I see you haven't posted anything. Well any comments about the new chapters?
Pablo Batanero Advanced 1-F
It is fantastic to see Marian out home under the rain, and she endures every bad moment if she can understant what it is happen and to help her sister, and herself too.
She realises that Count Fosco is a villain and he is a clever intrigant person, but I have to say that he is delicious, he is the spice of the novel.
I disagree. I don´t like flattering people, even animals who creep seem to me unpleasant.
If I had to chose I would prefer Frederick Fairlie, the most freaky character in the novel.
In spite of appearances we have to admit that FREDERICK FAIRLIE is not such a self-centered person as he is ready to admit his nice LAURA at Limmeridge house.He even shows a certain interest for her poor maid whom she is called by him as THE YOUNG PERSON. What we still have to find out it is why COUNT FOSCO pays him a visit to plead for LAURA´S admitance.
Leaving aside the spoilt, selfish and classist Mr. Fairlie´s personality I have to admit that his words about single and married peolple contain some truths.
The responsability of being a parent exempt their from other liabilities in some ways.
On the other hand, it is funny to see how Frederick Fairlie justify oneself constantly. Although this character is a little exaggerated we can recognize one of our faults
I believe that the Mr. Fairlie’s story is fantastic and wonderful. While he is writing, we can see the kind of person that he is. Mr. Fairle is selfish, snob, moaner and a man who is thinking in himself all the day.
I really like the dialogue between Louis, Lady Glady’s maid and Mr. Fairlie. It’s fantastic when Louis has to translate or transmit to Mr. Fairlie the Fanny words’. I imagine Mr. Fairlie very upset without paying attention to Fanny and only thinking about saying goodbye her.
Moreover, about the conversation between Mr. Fairlie and Count Fosco, I only can say that the Count is very clever, and we can suspect that his intentions are not good and that he has a terrible plan.
Sorry, I have seen a mistake in my words: " a man who is thinking about himself"
In order to get rid of THE COUNT as soon as possible MR FAIRLIE writes a very short letter to his niece LAURA inviting her to LIMMERIDGE HOUSE whenever she likes.However,deeply in his mind,he knows that she will not consent to leave her sister while she is ill. It is very amusing to see how he dreads to be infected by the possible virus which COUNT FOSCO may have brought with him and immediately has an aromatic bath.
Poor Laura and Marian, they are going to be separated! Marian got fever so she is ill and for this weak and Laura without Marian close to her is totally weak... Sometimes I feel Fosco is playing chess and pieces are people who are around him so he decides which is going to be the next movement.
mmmmm
Pablo, out of home.., to understand what has happened to her sister.., and that he is...,
I agree with you completely. Oh for a Marian in our lives! Although one would say: I am selfish to have a person so devoted to me, Marian has no life but her sister's well-being.
Fosco as you say is the salt and pepper the novel without him would be totally different and probably not so interesting.
Mercedes, well Mr.Fairlie is a good character, as you say, as far as a character goes. He is funny and so selfish that he could be Marian's counterpart, she being the least selfish, but I am devoted to Fosco too. His intelligence and handling of the situations is great, he is a flatterer, but everybody falls under his charm. Marian herself is caught in it. No, no I am decidedly for Fosco, although I really want to see him in prision, and saying: I have walked on the egg shell!
Julio, you are right.
I think that he admits her because he has to as it would be socially improper not to. He only does things because he is compelled to. As for your second idea... that is a good question. I am afraid Fosco has a plan and that is part of the plan. He is certainly not doing it to help the girls get out, so they have to cross their fingers for luck, they are probably going to need it.
Mercedes, Mr.Fairlie's spoilt..., how Frederick F justifieS himself..,
Yes, a good point! It is true for most of us. And I agree about the comments, one often sees parents taking advantage of grandparents and aunts and uncles. I think that in Spain now this is more so and they comment it on the news often. The poor grandparents fetching carrying paying for, etc. That generation is unique... and I don't think the children value them.
Olimpia, a snob a moaner.., Fanny's words.., the possessor first.
.. saying goodbye to her...,
Well done for the alteration!
Yes, that conversation is fantastic! How can Loui put up with Mr. F? A silly question I know, but I can't stop thinking about it every time they appear. If the act itself were not so stressful, and the thought impossible in a novel of this period, I would say that Mr. F and Loui would be more than servant and master. But of course there is nothing of that!
Julio, deep down..,
Yes, ha ha that is really funny! Mr. F knows Marian and Laura but I think he believes that they agree with the Count's proposal, but in any case he wants to be little disturbed!
Laura, Marian has got a fever and is weak for this..., Laura is totally lost without Marian near her..
A very good image the Count playing chess with real people! Who is next? Things are getting worse and worse for those two. I think that if Marian's dies Laura's will go mad, what is there left for her? In those circumstances who would like to go on living? When one thinks of the two happy girls at Limmeridge and sees them now, one wonders at the turns of life. We have to talk about that in class.
Hello guys, I last wrote down two weeks ago and the reason was not arose from laking of entusiashsm but internet page error. Whatever reason, I think Mr. Fairlie´s behaivour is not proper from a family head as he cares nothing about their Laura and Marian´s fate. He just takes care on himself.
See you!
If Fosco had to beg for money I would be glad. It is the worst that can happen to him.
Only I would like to say that I like Fairlie´s character. Because I think he´s a good person and he´s very clever, he doen´t surprise with the visit of Sr. Persival and he doesn´t doubt that Sr. Persival is a murderer. But I don´t understand what is the interest of Persival, I don´t understand neither why he wants that Laura comes back to Fairlie´s home.
Hello guys....I am using this blog to inform 1F Class tomorrow I will not attend to class because of my mother´s eye surgery. I would be appreciate if anyone send student´s email list to me in order to ask anyone to replace me.
My email address is jramosvaie@gmail.com.
Thanks
jjg
Julian, the reason was not lack of interest..., is not proper for the head of a family as he cares nothing for L and M's fate..., he just cares for himself.
You are right about Mr. F, but after the chapter that we have read I am prepared to excuse him for he makes me laugh so!!!
Mercedes, sure. That is why Mr. F's comment about giving him 5 shillings, which is so very demolishing, is great. He looks down on him so!
Gloria, he isn't surprised at Fosco's visit.., what Fosco's interest is..,I don't understand either why he wants Laura to return to Mr.Fairlie's house.
Well that is what we will discover but it is certainly something that will not benefit her, he has obviously got a plan to serve his ends.
Do you think that Mr.Fairlie thinks he is a murderer? I don't, though Mr. F doesn't like foreigners and I don't think he particularly likes Fosco, but I am sure he has no idea of Fosco¡s true personality. Mr.F is just worried about himself.
Julian, I will not attend the lesson.., I would appreciate it if anyone send me the email list in order that I find someone to replace me.
Thank you for your message and I hope your Mummy gets well soon.
Please if anyone can replace Julian contact him so that he tells you what he had to do, I can't remember. Thank you
Hello.
Pablo Advanced 1-F
I have a problem with the blog, I can´t see other news text since 16th of February.
I don´t know if I have to do an update or another thing.
Thank you.
Hello guys......further to text planned for tomorrow class I had to brief Henna Art. It's just 10 lines. Thank you
Hello Pablo, try link below
http://eoigoyainglesreadingclub.blogspot.com/2011/10/woman-in-white-wilkie-collins.html?commentPage=2
See you
gfgd
Pablo, I think you have to do what Julián tells you, but what we used to do, now I can't either, is press on el más reciente, and then go to formulario.
Apparently we are on a different window.
But there is a problem for me, I don't know if it happens to you too. First I have to post a message and then the words: el más reciente appear, and then I do the process that I told you above.
dfhsdfhd
fjfjfj
Yesterday, in our class we could see how Mr Farlie has sense of humour.
I think sense of humour is necessary to live the things in a better way, because if I have a problem or I do something wrong and I can't be able to live it with a little humour I always will be serious and worried about the mistakes.
If I see only the mistakes that I do, I won't be able to improve my skills.
I think it is completely necessary laughing of yourself when not every things happens in the way that I hope.
Ana
gghf
Ana, to live things.., I am not able.., it is completely necessary to laugh at yourself when thing don't happen in the way you want...
I agree, sense of humour is one of the best things we can have, I actually agree with the British on this.
Frankly it was a surprise for me to see that Mr. Fairlie has it.
MRS. ELIZA MICHELSON is undoubtedly a very honest person and capable as a good housekeeper. Through her ,we can see the differences that there were still between anglicans and catholics as she things that foreigners are brought up in the blind errors of popery.Of course she is the widow of a parson and perhaps because of his influence, she is quite sure of that assumption.
MRS. ELIZA MICHELSON Is undoubtedly a very honest person and capable as a good housekeeper.Tthrough her we can tell the differences that still were between anglicans and catholics as she thinks that foreigners are brought up in the blind errors of popery.Of course she is the widow of a parson and perhaps because of his influence she is quiet sure of that assumption.
I would like to rectify the following errors. STILL was not correcyly placed on the first .On the second one I wrote QUIET instead of QUITE. I apologize.
Poor Eliza Michelson, her husband is always present in her thoughts. What nightmare! In my opinion, being wife of a parson at that epoch was awful.
On the other hand, it is interesting to see how she sais "I offer facts only" when really she express her opinions. Again Fosco´s hand tries to change events.
jañljfld
Julio, you are right. It was very common to have this type of Puritanical characters in novels and I fear it was because there were a lot of them!
Mrs. Michelson means well and I think she is altogether a good person but she despises foreigners, which is not very Christian and she gossips a little too. Thanks to that we get a lot of information that is useful for the story, don't you think?
Mercedes, at that time.. (epoch, is too grand), she expressES...,
Yes, I agree and it is something we all do, don't you think? It is very difficult to make an objective comment, but as I said before it is very convenient for us as we find out things that with the plain facts we wouldn't have noticed. For example about Mrs. Rubelle.
Julio, it is fantastic to correct yourself well done.
I've found Frederick Fairlie's part of the book absolutely delightful. Poor Mr. Fairlie, he thought that once he had Laura married, he was finally left alone. How wrong was he!!! He is still going to be upset for a while...
About Mrs. Michelson's first episode I've noticed something curious: why did Count Fosco keep Laura away from Marian? Laura fallen ill with Typhus (and probably died) it would have been very convinient for Sir Percival and himself. Why did they lose the opportunity of get rid of her without suspicious? It makes me think that they've already had a plan for her, and not a very good one.
Pablo Advanced 1-F
Hello.
Sir Percival is a snake, he is mad, how can send Laura in that state of nervous to London, and with lies, Marian is in Blackwather.
Mrs Michelson feels ungry and embarras from Sir Percival for he is doing to Laura, he is rude and a bastard.
As regards to Mrs Michelson´s chapter I...
Count Fosco is very sly, because he is capable to persuade Mrs Michelson to tell him where Fanny was and, in this way, he could be able to get the Marian´s letters.
I think Count Fosco had founded Anne Catherick, because when Sir Percival asked him, Fosco made no reply in words but he smiled.
I wonder Where Anne Catherick is?
xbxx
Nuria, Marian has fallen ill.. and she will probably die..., of getting rid of.., without being suspects.., they have already thought of a plan..,
You are right, it would be very convenient if Marian died because it left Laura defenceless, but on the other hand two girls dying so soon would be suspicious and really the one who has to die is Laura, as with her death they would both gain. Marian is dangerous for them as a prospective investigator of her sister's death, but not otherwise as she is poor and not connected to them in anyway.
Pablo, how can he send Laura.., nervous state.., angry and embarassed for what Sir P is doing to Laura..,
I agree entirely he is so. And he doesn't even bother to pretend before people, it is not a good tactic. At the end of the chapter Mrs. M wants to leave service, she sees things quite well but she trusts too much in Sir P, in that she is candid
Ana, Fosco has FOUND..,
I agree, Fosco is sly as Marian said a very dangerous enemy, and poor Anne! I think the Count has found her!!!!!!!!!! She is at his mercy because he has charm and conquers all women except for Laura, in that Laura shows more insight than the others.. Well Marian saw through him too.
Marta, thank you for the corrections. I though I didn't explain myself or you missunderstand me.
What I wanted to say was that if Laura has become infected with the Typhus and has died, it would have been very convinient for both Sir Percival and count Fosco. So it's very strage that they have protected Laura from the infection, don't you think?
As I've read in Mrs. Michelson's second chapter, probably they were thinking that while Marian were sick, they could handle Laura without her interference.
I regret to inform you that due to the illnesss of a relative who is in hospital, I will not attend your class on Monday the 13th. On wednesday the 15th probably it will be the same as Ihave a sore foot and I will have to go to the specialist. I´LL Cotinue reading the Novel and doing the corresponding exercises. I will miss you.
MRS.ELIZA MICHELSON,apart from being the perfect house keeper is a very religious and honest person.However it is surprising to read that she considers FOSCO inocent,probably because she does know about the wicked dealings that against the two sisters,PERCIVAL andTHE COUNT are carrying out.
MRS.ELIZA MICHELSON,apart from being the perfect house keeper is a very religious and honest person.However it is surprising to read that she considers FOSCO inocent,probably because she does know about the wicked dealings that against the two sisters,PERCIVAL andTHE COUNT are carrying out.
gsre
Nuria, understood..,
you are right I didn't catch it, now I see what you mean. The objection to that plan, infecting Laura with the typhus, has a big problem as I see it, that it can appear suspicious as if Laura died maybe an investigation would open to see how this happened. Marian would certainly investigate don't you think? They have to do it well, or they might end in prision, for if Laura dies they get the money and the fact that she died so soon after her marriage.... However the possibility of what you say exists
Julio, I'm sorry but don't worry. I hope your relative gets well soon and that your foot mends too. We will miss you but as you write in the blog, we'll be in touch.
Julio, that Sir P and the Count are carrying out against the two sisters...
I agree that Mrs. Michelson is a very good housekeeper and religious, I would say puritanical as she quotes from the Bible and is critical of other people though she knows her place well and just only mentions things. I don't agree, however with what you say about her knowing what Sir P and Fosco are doing to the girls. I think she is totally ignorant of what they are doing. She sees there are weird things but doesn't really know more. And then when she is informed by Walter, she puts all the blame on Sir P, and excuses the Count. Well the Count took pains to win her and Sir P on the other didn't.
Why does Sir Percival avoid Laura´s eyes?
Why doesn´t he go to say her good bye?
Why does he leave Blackwater in such a way?
Maybe, his conscience is troubling him or there is a "phantom" in the house, now that Laura is like Anne.
Fosco´s plans point him as guilty, if something happens to Laura.
Laura´s death will be suspicious and Sir Percival´s violence is an aggravanting circumstance. Fosco needs money and Sir Percival is the key to obtain it. Perhaps Fosco
is involved in Sir Percival´s behavior.
The narratives of the first three persons involved in this part of the novel are really interesting but sometimes very sad,especially when it is described LADY GLYDE´S DEATH.However nothing is so exciting as WALTER´S meeting with those two women who were looking at the tomb of his inmense love LAURA and the unknown one lifts her veil and suddenly he discovers that it is LAURA herself
hcfgh
Mercedes, why doesn't he go to say goodbye to her..,
Very interesting thoughts... and I agree maybe Fosco has to do with Sir P's anger, what has put him out so much? It must be something awful.
And yes maybe Sir P has a qualms after all!
I am afraid we are not going to discover why he is so angry just yet.
Julio, Lady Glyde's death is described...,
One thinks of poor Laura dead, without Marian's holding her hand, and of Marian who is now left so lonely and destitute.
And I agree it is exiting...
It is getting better and better
The book is getting more and more interesting!!! Who has died in the last chapter??? It wasn´t Laura or maybe Walter was deliriousing when he saw her, but I don´t think so... Laura and Anne Catherick were pretty similar so maybe Anne Catherick was who died, if it is true... finally she doesn´t tell sir Percival´s secret!!!
There are so many misterious to solve that sometimes it´s quite difficult not go on reading the book!!
The story continued by WALTER HARTRIGHT is one of the saddest and most interesting piece of the novel.COUNT FOSCO is really a very wwicked man.How poor LADY GLYDE is pleced in the asylum is distressing.MISS HALCOMBE´S courage to rescue her is admirable and at the end,under very difficult circumtances,WALTER and the two sister are together.
sdhsdh
Laura, A.C. was the one who died.., mysteries to solve.., not to go on..,
I am so glad you find it so!! I agree it is gripping, but we must keep pace or it is ruined because it is very important that nobody lets out imformation.
I am afraid poor Anne is now dead, though I didn't see it myself as I was reading, it was one of you who said so, but how and who is Laura if that be the case?
Laura, A.C. was the one who died.., mysteries to solve.., not to go on..,
I am so glad you find it so!! I agree it is gripping, but we must keep pace or it is ruined because it is very important that nobody lets out imformation.
I am afraid poor Anne is now dead, though I didn't see it myself as I was reading, it was one of you who said so, but how and who is Laura if that be the case?
Julio, sisters..., pieces...,
I couldn't agree more, what suffering for poor Laura! I am sure that affects you, suffering is something that has a cost, it is difficult to overcome it specially when you have been so protected all your life.
Wellcome Walter.Despite the sorrow circumstances, wellcome. We all missed you a lot. We missed the fair and passionate soul of an artist. And we also missed your clean powerful narrative (I have almost cried over Laura´s tombstone)
My condolences.
Wellcome, Walter. Despite the sorrow circumstances, wellcome. We all missed you a lot. We missed the fair passionate soul of an artist. And we also missed your clean powerful narrative (I have almost cried over Laura´s tombstone). I´m on your side. My condolences.
Even in these sorrowful circumstances, wellcome Walter. We all missed you a lot. We missed your fair passionate soul: the soul of an artist. We also missed your clean powerful narrative (I have almost cried as you have before Laura´s tombstone. I´m on your side. My condolences.
Even in these sorrowful circumstances, wellcome Walter. We missed you a lot. We missed the fair passionate soul of an artist. And we also missed your clean powerful narrative (I have almost cried as you have before Laura´s tomb). I´m on your side. My condolences.
gdffdfd
Javier, the sorrowful..,
What a very nice comment! There is a bit of the poet in you!
What do the rest of you think?
Javier, I see that you corrected yourself, well done. I always read one at a time and so this happens
One of the most moving part of the third epoch story continued by WALTER HARTRIGHT it is when in the asylum grounds MISS HALCOMBE and her sister recognised each other rushing into their arms almost immediately.MARIAN´S efforts to rescue her required a practical mind,generosity and a great love.All these qualities are shown by her throughout the NOVEL.Undoubtedly she is one of the main characters in it.
The story changes in few pages after some long descriptive chapters. We needed an explanation about Laura´s death an resurrection.
Now we understan what happened and how Count Fosco and Sir Percival achived their target.
However, Mariam can ruin Count Fosco plan. She has trust in Walter and, also she relies on him for returning to Laura her identity.
It won´t be easy because they are banished and they live as outlaws.
I hope Sir Percival´s secret isn´t buried in Anne´s tomb.
Count Fosco´s plan, sorry.
gdfd
Julio, one of the most moving parts is when..., and the sisters recognised each other.., undoubtedly is she...,
Yes I like it too it is very moving, and I am so glad that Marian is clever! And Laura must be glad too because Marian has saved her.
Mercedes, Count Fosco's plan
Yes, that is the only chance they have! You put it very well, they are outlaws now and they have no money on tòp. The situation is terrible and also the Count is alive so he can look for them and...
I have read your correction well done!
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Hello guys! Very long time I didn´t post anything....first of all, I would like blogger administrators to remove 100 postings at least as it struggles to surf on internet to set down.
As regards the novel, I think Fosco´s plan has been great since Laura remains alive together with her sister as nobody will miss a poor creature as Anne Catherick. I also think Fosco knew Marian listened to them that night which made her ill. For that reason, Fosco marked out in letter sent to Mr.Fairlie Ann Catherick had been placed in Aysilum. Moreover, he set down Anne Catherick believes herself be Lady Glyde. Therfore, Fosco is an accomplished person who is able to manage a murder under an appearance of sensitive human being. Marian knows this point thereby he was afraid of him. See you!
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Julián, it's a very long time since I posted..,
How can we do what you say? We are not very good with the internet so we don't know how to do it. I suppose you are right.
He wrote that Anne believed herself to be..., the appearance of a sensitive human being.., and consequently she was afraid of him.
Quite a good analysis you have summarized the situation nicely. I think like you, what a plan has Fosco carried out a clever plan fantastically. He has not disappointed me in the least.
He has all the money and has left the two sisters destitute, I wonder why he didn't get rid of Marian, maybe that was a mistake...
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The third story of the past continued by HARTRIGHT is really very interesting and I cannot help but feeling great pity for poor LAURA who is still under the influence of having been confined in the asylum.Of course he does his best to encourage her and among many ways to do so he teaches her how to draw again. It is very intriguing to notice how he is followed by two elusive men and how he tries to elude them.
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Julio, a very good comment and well-written too. In many ways I would say more than among but apart from that fine and with good vocabulary use.
I agree, now maybe they are going to get in trouble with the Count. For if they rid him of the money he has grabbed, he is going to fight back. I think that Walter is improving, don't you? Like Elisabeth Bennet said of Mr. Darcy to Mr. Wickham: He improves on acquaintance.
Will our heros get their target? It seems that the important matter is to know a date. They have to find a person who testifies to the Laura´s departure day from Blackwatwer to London. They should watch one´s step, because Count Fosco does´t rest. The solicitor speaks plainly to Walter who realizes the situation. Meanwhile we can see how Laura´s health has deteriorate and how Mariam and Walter try to help her.
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Mercedes, Laura's departure day.., but I think it would be better to say: the day in which Laura left Blackwater park for London.., watch their steps..., has deteriorateD...,
Yes, it is wonderful to have such devotion! And from two people too! That is what is really incredible in the novel. Or does that happen? I suppose that sometimes it does. But it is not so common, such unselfish devotion, and now it continues when she has no money at all.
I think the Count has done his job well and it is going to be difficult to prove that Laura is alive.
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Well no comments about the latest events? I think you are overwhelmed with the situation.
What are they going to do? Which is Sir Percival's secret?
At this point in the novel, it's crystal clear than Anne Catherick was Laura's sister. Probably Sir Percival had helped Laura's father hiding the scandal, and he had obteined Laura's hand as a reward. However, that didn't seem a secret that could ruin somebody's life, except maybe Laura's father's, but he had already dead.
On the other hand, if Laura had passed a night in London before being taken to the Asylum, where had she been? Perphaps there were someone else who could provide an evidence related to the date in which she arrived.
It is admirable to see WALTER´S tenacity in order to find out the wicked reasons and punishable actions to inherit LAURA´S money simulating her death .MRS.CLEMENTS,who was so kind to ANNE may be useful to him.
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Nuria, helped Mr.F to hide the scandal..., he was already dead.., there was someone else....,
That is a good point, there might be somebody. The only snag is that if Fosco had met her at the station as he promised he would do, how could that be? It would probably be at the house of a person that Fosco could trust and then there was nothing to do.
As for the first comment I agree that Anne must be Laura's sister and that that was not really so awful at that time. It happened to many men, but it could be as Sir Percival is a friend of Anne's mother. The only thing is that Sir P said it could be his ruin not Mr. Fairlie's.
Julio, I agree on both statements. Walter now appears in a new light, he is a different man, hardship and suffering have made a man of him. And I am sure that Mrs. Clements will be of help.
It is getting more and more interesting.
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I think that Laura and Anne are sisters. As a consequence Anne is also heiress. Now, according to law, Anne is alive and it could suppose a problem to Sir Percival. However, it must have other secret.
Sir Percival left Blackwater like a mad and I don´t know the reason of his behavior. What happened the day that Laura goes to London? Maybe Anne died that day and Sir Percival heard it.
Things didn´t go according to plan.
MRS CLEMENTS´ anxiety about ANNE´S mysterious disappearance is clearly shown when she is visited by WALTER.The behaviour shown by COUNT and COUNTESS FOSCO is more than dobious and the reader wonders why she trusted him when they met,but unfortunately did not see LADY GLYDE.
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Mercedes, according to the law.., however there must be another secret.., a mad man.., I don't know why this behaviour.., on that day.., according to the plan.
Yes I agree with you they must be sisters why if not are they so alike? And what you point at is an interesting possibility, that would explain why they killed her.
Julio, un fortunately she didn't see Lady Glide...,
Mrs. Clemens is a very good woman, honest and good. One sees that all through the novel but also now when she is with Walter.
Poor Anne, she had found a good woman to look after her and she couldn't go and live with her for long.
I wonder what the mother is like, she must be horrible!
In the last two chapter Walter has confessed that his feeling towards Laura have totally changed. When he thinks in Laura he doesn´t feel love like he used to, now he feels affection like a father or brother...
But whatever Walter feels towards her she is very lucky because Marian and he never are going to leave her.
Anne´s life was really awful. She didn´t know her father and her mother didn´t take care of her. When she escapes from the asylum and she gets to find Mrs. Clements
new trouble appear. I would like to know more about her story and why she was such a fond of Laura´s mother. She died of exhaustion with strangers around her. Seldon have I read something so sad.
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Laura, think of.., are never going...
I agree. I think the author does it because it would not be proper for Laura and Walter to be leaving in the same house with only Marian. So to feel as a brother is perfect, don't you think?
Mercedes, why she was so fond of Laura's mother..,
You are very right. It is very sad, the only good thing that happened to her is that now she is with Mrs. Fairlie as was her wish.
I think she is interested in Laura because of her devotion to her mother. I think that is it. Poor Anne was very greatful to the person who was kind to her in her childhood.
I feel very very sorry for her too. What a sad life!
Hello guys,...the relation between Walter and Laura gets cold even freezes....I think despite the general opinion which agrees Walter will marry Laura I am against it. Marian and Walter also share a secret which Laura ignores. It may Laura distrust Walter for that reason since somehow Laura feels disappointed in a fictional environment far from real world. See you!
The third Epoch VII The reader can notice how good MRS.CLEMENTS is and how much she loved ANNE CATHERICK as she practically brought her up as if she were her own child and even taught her to walk.At the same time she reveals how wicked and shrewd her mother was especially for her husband and how conspicuosly bad SIR PERCIVAL GLYDE is.
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Julián, it may make Laura...
Which is the secret they share?? I am not sure what you mean.
I think it is done for reasons of social conventionalisms, but it is suprising that he should feel so. Yet when one thinks that she was as good as a fool one would not wonder at his change.
Julio, specially to her husband...,
I agree, Mrs. Clements is one of those really good people, in some ways even better than Marian. Marian is devoted to her sister and depends on her, but Mrs. Clements looks after a mentally weird girl who is not at all related to her and whom she supports. She is really kind.
As for the other two you mention.... Mrs. Catherick is or must be a monster and we know how Sir Percival has acted so far, so....
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No comments about these new chapters???
Well come on remember we do this to practise
Hello guys....my last post was not so acurate as I expected even I would say a bit confussing. I meant, the shared secret between Walter and Marian referred Marian knows Walter´s action plan. Moreover, Marian also knows Walter conceive Laura the real drawings client in order to convince Laura she contributes household expenditure.
I hope this clarification helps you.
Ciao
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Julián, I would even say a bit..., when I mentioned the shared secret between Walter and Marian, I meant that Marian knew Walter's plans to advance in the quest they had started..., Marian also knows that Walter conceals from Laura the truth about her paintings. He buys the paintings in order that she should have some money to contribute to the household expenses.
Yes it is very kind of Walter and Marian, and what surprises me more is the devotion they have for her. How very lucky she is!! It is true though that the way they act fits the male wish of the Victorian time, in which the ideal was to treat women as children as that is what they were considered to be.
Laura is exactly that at this moment.
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Darlings, when are you going to post something???? Remember we do this for you to practise your writing skills and you are not doing the practice!!!!!
It is a pity to read that the church at the old WELMINGHAM was so neglected.Its bad state is shown by its twelve apostles in wood without a nose in any of them.The PARISH CLERK seems to be very provincial and very talkative but he is very useful for WALTER allowing him to keep his eyes peeled for the parish register.
Finally we have discovered Sir Percival´s secret!!!! I´m going to write nothing about that because maybe somebody who is reading the blog doens´t know the secret yet, but I,m going only to say that it is really shocked!!
I am not really sure if the person who was inside the church was sir Percival because Walter has never seen before, and what about sir Percival´s servant? he is too strange... I think there are some mess to unravel yet.
Anyway, the last two chpater have been very interesting with fights, pursuits,a fire, more mysteries...
Mrs. Clements is a charming and strong person. She was like a mother to Anne, but she always depended on Mrs. Catherick temper to be with her.
Bearing this situation is really difficult. Mrs. Catherick seems to blame Anne for the circunstances. Mrs Clemens can´t intercede with Mrs Catherick for Anne. I can imagine the helplessness she feels.
Words can´t express her sorrow.
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Julio, a very true comment and well-written too. Everything is as you say, and one has to admit that Walter was quite right in going to the vestry! And that the clerk said something very important to Walter.
Laura, it is really shocking!..., never seen him before.., there is some mess..,
You have been very clever not to reveal the secret, there is a group who is not going to find out until after Easter!
Well you are right, two very interesting chapters with a lot of action! And I agree too, I couldn't believe it either, no wonder that he said it was his ruin!
Mercedes, I couldn't agree more. You have expressed it very well and this is what I wanted to say when I was talking about Mrs.Clements compared to Mrs.Catherick who I insist is the awful one in the novel. What she does to her daughter is really cruel, what an unhappy life poor Anne had! Always yearning for a bit of kindness! And all that thanks to her wicked mother! Fosco has a purpose, he needs money, but what is her purpose?
I'm struck by the disclosure of Sir Percival's secret!! Never did I think about that eventuality, although I really suspected the secret had to do nothing with Anne Catherick. However, I wonder if Walter will be able to demonstrate what he has found out after the events which took place lately. There seem to be a possibility Mrs. Catherick wanted to contribute in Walter's cause now.
Pablo Advanced 1-F
Hello.
In my opinion, Walter after knowing the secret, he has to fight against Sir Percival and Count Fosco.
If he does the correct, and he takes good decisions may be he gets the revenge, and he could become happy with Laura and Marian.
I agree that Mrs Catherick is an awful person. It is too obvious. On the other hand I take pity on her because I think that she is a victim, and surely she is a mad person.
As far as I know Mrs Catherick has lived isolate, without friends, without love. She has had trouble even with her innocent daughter.
However, she takes care of her sister before her death.
She isn´t and she has been happy.
Life must be difficult to a poor woman at that time and in that village under the circumstances.
In my opinion, her behavior is a consequence of her illness. However Fosco is capable of doing everything to get money. We are witness. Is money a good justification? Maibe if you need it to eat, but in that case it isn´t the reason.
Mercedes, I agree with you. Firstly, Mrs Catherick coul had her reasons for her behaviour, whether we liked them or not; but Count Fosco's only reason was ambition. Secondly, Mrs. Catherick always acted as she was, whereas the count was a pretender. As a saying we have in Spanish: "God deliver us from quiet waters; turbulent ones I see when coming".
Sorry, I repeted my entry to correct some mistakes.
Mercedes, I agree with you. Firstly, Mrs Catherick could had her reasons for her behaviour, whether we liked them or not; but Count Fosco's only reason was ambition. Secondly, Mrs. Catherick always acted the way she was, whereas the count was a trickster. As a saying we have in Spanish: "God deliver us from quiet waters; turbulent ones I see when coming".
Hello guys.....I agree with all of you about Mrs. Catherick´s bad temper arose likely from a long life disgrace. On the other hand, I would like to stress Walter´s strengh both pishical and mental. Firstly, when he faced up with Sr. Percival´s guards in his way to Old Welmingham. Secondly, when he left his prejudices against the person involves in the questioning fire.
See you!
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Nuria, the secret had nothing to do with... there seems to be a possibility of Mrs. C's wanting to contribute to...
Yes, I must say it never crossed my mind that the secret was THAT. It is indeed a terrible one, specially if we consider what the punishment was for people who did what Sir P had done!! It is in the notes at the end of the book.
Pablo, Walter after knowing the secret has to fight.., the correct thing.., maybe he will manage to revenge on..,
Undoubtedly. He will certainly have a cause and Sir P will be punished, though they still have to confess that Anne is the one in the grave because if they don't admit that... there must be a proof or else... God knows
Mercedes, lived isolated.., she isn't and hasn't been happy.., life must have been difficult for a poor..., we are witnesses..,
I agree with all that you say, but Mrs. Clements was also a poor woman and she acted very differently in life. Mrs. Catherick was horrible hard and cold, and cruel to her husband, daughter etc, life made her worse instead of better. Mrs. Clements said she was terrible too and yet she bowed down to the vicar for she only wanted social prestige. I agree that she must have been a bit insane too.
And she wanted money, she was very happily accepting Sir Percival's
Nuria, could have...,
The saying in English is: Shallow waters run deep.
I see your point, I agree that Fosco is worse, well he was prepared to kill and I don't see Mrs. C killing anyone, not physically anyway, but he was clever too much more than her. She was obstinate, if she had gone to America, she would have taken the right decision, in my opinion.
I think Fosco did everything because he needed money that was the reason. Don't you think?
Julián, Mrs. C's bad temper arising.., he faced Sir P's...., on his way to..., against the person involved in the fire accident..,
You are right, now Walter is shining! At last one has to add. He behaves well and corageously in all the situations, he is fighting and solving all the problems and has not lost his honesty and goodness. A revelation. Marian's counterpart, it is a pity they would have been perfect together, but...
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The vestry on fire is really terrible and the effort made by WALTER trying to save SIR PERCIVAL is heroic. Few readers would think that the end of this man would be like that. Thescene of the flames seen from town gives you idea of how the scanty inhabitants of the old village yearn in despair for the fire engine to come.
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Julio, a very true comment. I hadn't thought about that. A fire must have been something terrible at that time, how very difficult to control it always is now let alone at that time!!
Don't you think it is a premotion of where Sir Percival is going to rest??? In Hell I mean... he certainly deserved something like that considering what he had done, he had no mercy with poor Laura, who would have given him anything and everything as she said herself when he wanted her to sign, she only wanted to read the paper, but she was willing to give if necessary.
The good end well, the bad end badly, and the tone at the end of the chapter suggests the elated moment, don't you think
I had completely changed my mind about Mrs. Catherick after reading her letter to Walter. The way she thanked him for being the resort to reach Sir Percival's death, as if Walter had killed him instead of the fire, and how she would have rewarded him if she had been younger, assuming Walter wouldn't have rejected her... I now find her the most disgusting character in the novel. In spite of have lived unhappily, I can't justify her anymore.
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Nuria, in spite of having lived..,
I agree, you put it very well, she is horrible. The examples you provide show indeed the kind of woman she was, and the way in which she hated Sir Percival and at the same time she took his money! I tell you, I prefer Fosco, she is for me the worst character in the novel by far. To think that she showed so much feeling for Sir P´s death and none at all when she found out about her daughter's!! She is also a fast woman, to thank men as she suggests is, well, what is the name????
And what does she imply about Miss. Halcombe's mother? She is vulgar to the extreme.
In spite of WALTER´S lack of interest for seeing MRS.CATHERICK,her letter to him is undoubtedly the key of the problem for finding out SIR PERCIVAL GLYDE´S attitude through-out the novel.At the same time you can notice that MRS.CATHERICK was never a model mother and does not appear to regret to have loved her daughter as she should have done not even understanding her passion for whiteness.
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Julio, to regret not having loved her daughter as she should have...,
Mrs. Catherick shows herself in the letter as the cold, horrible, human being that she is. And she even offers herself to Walter, had she been younger! It is a miracle Anne was such a good girl with that mother. She is worse than Fosco for me, she didn't actually kill anyone but what she did to her daughter was worse than that. In fact poor Anne wanted to die and be buried with Mrs. Fairlie
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How important is for MRS.CATHERICK to keep her status at old WELMINGHAM it is more than proved by her crazy interest to be always bowed by the clergyman and eventually by his wife if she joins the Dorcas Society. Her letter addressed to WALTER shows her selfishness and how wicked SIR PERCIVAL GLYDE is trying by all means to hide his doubtful ancestry.
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Julio, how important it is for...,
Indeed her letter shows to what extent she is prepared to do things. Even to have sex as a means to thank a man for a favour, not a very elevating idea...
I agree it shows her selfishness and madness too. She only wants things for herself, she is horrible. Mrs. Clements was right, she is an awful woman.
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Pablo Advanced 1-F
Hello.
I am reading the chapter x, and It is really interesting, Walter is realising what is the real truth about Sir Percival.
Walter had two ideas about what was the relation between Sir Percival and Anne Catherick, but he was wrong. After Mr Hartright has check the differences between the two lists of marriages, Walter knows the truth, and he has the key for releasing his dear love Laura.
I wish Walter will be able to hide from Sir Percival´s bullies, and to escape.
If he escapes, he could go to the police to bring the light the real truth.
11/04/2012
Pablo Advanced 1-F
Hi everybody.
I have read chapter ten completely therefore I know the truth and the Sir Percival´s secret, but I had never forgotten that Sir Percival would dye in the church!!!
It was amazing the end of the chapter; I could not think this end.
Walter is a very good person, and he shows us how brave and altruist person he is, when he tried to save Sir Percival although he is risking his life with the rescue.
At the beginning of chapter XI I appreciate one thing I didn’t like it…when Walter is writing a letter to Marian and he suggested that he didn’t write that letter to other woman, but Marian is special and different; I think Wilkie Collins was a little sexist.
Now that we are almost in the end of the novel, that we finally know Sir Percival's secret, that we have been told about the relation between Laura and Anne Catherick... There appears a new secret!! That one that Walter and Marian share, even they had never said any word about it. Should the time come, Walter will tell Laura about it. What could it be? Might walter think to propose her, in her state of health and mind?
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Pablo, I had never thought..., the end of the chapter was amazing.., to another woman..,
When I read it I was also surprised it is a very good way of killing Sir Percival in a church in a fire!!!
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Pablo in your first message: has checked.., I wish Walter escaped from..., If he escaped he would be..,
Careful with the sequence of the conditional sentences it is like in Spanish!
Yes Walter has the key but now Laura is married to a nobody who has usurped a name and position, a great offence in England! What is he going to do with that information?
Nuria, at the end..,
Yes you are right! Another secret! But this one we can guess more easily, I think.
What are they going to do with the information they have about Sir Percival? This is indeed another question to solve.
Mrs. Catherick writes a long letter to Walter explaining with the utmost detail the most important points of her life, of course she doesn´t mention any personal noun, because she knows it could be a mistake, but she explains her affair with Sir Percival, how her ambition lets her to go on with this relation, why and how they get to a lifetime deal, etc.
When I was reading this letter I was thinking it was a kind of confession, I think everybody need to share with someone our secrets that have never been told, and sometimes it is easier with somebody we have just met or an acquaintance.
So Mrs Catherick, probably unconsciously, decides to use to Walter like a kind of confessor for feeling better, so she looks back and she feels regretful and in that moment she is able to release from her sins or mistakes that determinated her life. Now when Sir Percival is dead and she has shared her own secrets she feels free.
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Laura, everybody needs..,
I agree with what you say about sharing secrets with people we don't know, but I also think that she wants to tell the truth because she wants him to know that she was right, and she wants to show her gratitude for Sir Percival's death which she puts on Walter.
...to use Walter..,that determined her life...,
Do you think so? She might feel free but better?? Well I suppose she is relieved to have lost Sir Percival as she hated him for having been the means of her loss of reputation, but otherwise....
She shows no regret of what she has done to her daughter, she even consented to have her put in the asylum only because he was afraid of her, and Mrs Catherick didn't want to lose her position in society now. That was horrible!
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Pablo Advanced 1-F
Hello.
If Walter had been rescued Sir Percival, he would have had problems the rest of his days, and he probably wouldn´t have married with his love Laura.
In my opinion Anne Catherick is the half sister of Laura, but Miss Catherick won´t recognise because she has to keep a reputation in her new city.
After reading Miss Catherick´s letter I feel sorry for Anne, Anne didn´t know the secret, but she was acting like a parrot and she was repeating the words of his mother, that was her sin, and for that reason Sir Percival ruins Anne´s life.
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Pablo, if Walter had rescued.., Laura's half sister.., won't admit it.., her mother's words..,
I agree with you, one feels so sorry for Anne! What had she done? But really it was all her mother's fault, she is a coward and was only interested in her well-being. She is hateful, poor Anne!
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