15 de octubre de 2009

EMMA

The groups of level A1 are going to read this novel by Jane Austen during the course. Please join in and post your comments.

907 comentarios:

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María. Av.1-D dijo...

Isidro I think that Mr. K. realized inmediately Mr. Elton´s infatuation but in this case he didn´t afraid of lose to Emma because he knew Emma´s feelings towards Mr. Elton, but in the case of Frank it was different because seemed to be that Emma was in love with Frank and it was a dangerous situation and it was necessary to act quickly.

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

I wanted to say that... Emma is unable to cope with problems....

Isidro dijo...

María. Av 1D, Mr K didn't need to act quickly because he knew by Mr Weston Frank's engagment to Jane.So, there was any risk, by this side.
In reality,when Mr K came back thought that Emma would be very saddened becase of the lost of Frank.
Only when he realized that Emma wasn't attached to Frank, did he decide to declare Emma his love.
At first, he didn't think to.

Isidro dijo...

.............because of the lost of Frank.....

Isidro dijo...

Oh dear! I'm sorry. ........because of Frank's loss....

marta dijo...

Mercedes, you have a point, the novel is a love novel because they marry for love but being English there is little passion, I agree that jealousy seems more present.
Mònica, you are right.
Ana Mª, good point about forgetting the letter, I think F is inmature and careless, he has a lot to learn and a long way to maturity.
Reyes, you are very right, I think it would be interesting to ask the Professor, don't you?

marta dijo...

Isidro, didn't have.., I don't think Mr.K was a coward and I can excuse her for not being honest about H, that would have been terrible. As long as Mr.K didn't know H would not be humilliated. I think she was right in keeping quiet about it.
I agree with María.
Isidro, I think it is possible that John K saw things better than his brother as he was not in love with E. Love is blind and can make you blind. Careful with the S you forget it sometimes!!
Isidro, you forgive E? I can't believe it. You say exactly what Jane says that the bad actions stay there forever. I don't want to see it that way it is terrible! I much rather forgive and give the person an opportunity if he/she is really sorry.

marta dijo...

María, as she appearS..,she findS..,he wasn't afraid of losing..,
I think you are right, being so pampered E unable to face up to problems she doesn't want to be disturbed by them, it is a little selfish, isn't it?
Isidro, do you mean it? Or are you sarcastic? I think that the passage shows that she has seen how badly and irresponsibly she has acted, thank you for putting the passage here.

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

Hi Marta I think that there are some problems in the blog because I am unable to see it in a good way; I only can see the last one but no the previous one. Please could you correct it?
Thanks, María

AV1-D dijo...

In the chapter 51 we see that M.K. follows thinking of F.Ch. is not a good person when E. gives him the letter to read it, he doesn’t change his opinion about him even though he recognizes that he is not impartial in his judgment.
He thinks of F.Ch. is scheming; he is playing with people, “always deceived in fact by his own wishes, and regardless of little besides his own convenience”.
And he uncovers the secret of “Pianoforté”, he calls “a boyish scheme”, here, we see the reason by F.Ch. doesn’t say anything about he was the person who sent the pianoforte to J.F. so she would not accept it because it was an expensive present that she could dispense with it.
I understand here, a woman should not accept an expensive gift if she is not engagement with the man who send her the present, do you think the same?

Mercedes AV1-D dijo...

I am sorry, I have forgotten put my name, it's me Mercedes.

Isidro dijo...

Marta, the first paragraph of your comment of 25 you say that you
“ can excuse Emma for not being honest about H, that would have been terrible”.
I think that you say this because you think that I have said a thing that I didn’t think when I wrote my comment.
I commented Mr K words when he spoke to Emma of importance of truth and sincerity in our dealing with each other.
In this moment, Mr K. was criticizing Frank’s behaviour. And she blushes because she realized that she shouldn’t have been flirted with Frank, while she believed that Harriet was in love with Frank.
Mr K talks about the beauty of truth and sincerity and Emma has been always manipulating and intriguing and she has played with Harriet’s feeling.
I don’t want Emma to say Mr K that Harriet is in love with him. I didn’t think in this when I spoke of Emma’s blush. I was alluding to her belief of Harriet’s love with Frank.
In my opinion, Mr K would have judged very negatively Emma’s flirting with Frank if he had known that Emma then thought that Harriet was in love with Frank.
Mr K was criticizing Frank and talking of truth and sincerity and she had to hide her real thought, therefore she blushes.

Isidro dijo...

Marta, you are right. I think like Jane that the bad actions are bad action forever. Therefore, people have remorse of conscience. But this doesn’t mean that a person should be ill forever.

I think that people must think before acting, because it is not indifferent to act well or not. We mustn’t act foolishly thinking that at the end we are going to be forgiven.
I believe that there is not a contradiction in saying that a person has been ill and defending her forgiveness, if there has been repentance.
For example, I think that a murder is a bad action. And the repentance doesn’t transform a bad action in a good one. So, though the murderer should become a good person, the murder always will be a bad action.
I apologize because the characters’ ill behaviours of the novel have little importance compared to this example.
I think that we all agree deep down, but we express thing differently.

Isidro dijo...

......I think that all of us agree deep down, but we express things differently.

clara dijo...

I haven't written in this blog for a long time because I can't see your posts. Do you know what's happening?

Isidro dijo...

María and Carol, I have also realized that there was something strange in the blog. What I have done to solve the problem is to click in “more recent” successively”, instead of clicking in “the most recent” .

Mª Av1-S dijo...

I like very much how Mr. K. analizes F.'s letter, not only can we see his accurate and witty point of view, but also we can compare F´s behavour towards J to the one that Mr K. has towards E., so he tries not to hurt her during all the reading of the letter. Also, I think that this contrast is increased by the fact that then they share an important decision, showing that they have an equal relationship.
However, and althoug it is for different reasons, the reality is that Mr.K. and E. have also a secret engagement. What do you think of it? Can you believe that of Mr K.?

Ana Martínez Esteban A1 S dijo...

I would like to say, according with my own perception about the characters, that I don’t find real evilness in any of them. I can’t see Emma as a wicked woman neither Frank as a diabolical man. Emma and Frank have been brought up in a particular way. They have always received too much praises along their lifes; both have been pampered by her families. They also have been used to get everything whenever they wanted. All of this can leave tracks in their personalities becoming them domineering people. Therefore these two characters may seem a little disagreeable to our eyes because, harmless as they are, they can hurt people’s feelings. On the contrary, the characters like Mr. K and Mrs. Weston are all kindness, affection and understanding.

Isidro dijo...

Maria Av1S, I agree with you in what you say about the way of analyzing the letter.
Mr K’s analysis is very “accurate and witty” and it is true that he tries not to hurt her. I think that because of this he doesn’t comment the passage when Frank talk about the party of Box Hill.
At the end, Mr Knightley adopts Emma’s point of view, influenced clearly by her.
She says:
“You will find how very much he suffers………………...I wish you would read it with a kinder spirit towards him…………………………..….. You do not appear so well satisfied with his letter as I am; but still you must, think the better of him for it. I hope it does him some service with you………..
Finally he says:
“I am ready to believe his character will improve, and acquire from her’s the steadiness and delicacy of principle that it wants.” (Chapter 51)

marta dijo...

María I can't help you! I'm terrible with the computer!
Mercedes, continues thinking that F is..,is not engaged to..,
I agree about presents at that time but now things are different.
Isidro, have been flirting.., thinking OF..,
I agree with you of course E has been plotting and men are not so manipulating as we are and of course Mr.K would have been angry with her but love excuses many things so ...
Clara you must go to el más reciente.

marta dijo...

María, that is true! The only difference is that it is because they don't want to hurt him, but you are right!
Ana Mª, many praises.., used to getting..,making them domineering..,
I think you are right none of them are really mean.
Isidro thanks for the quotes they are enlightening.

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

Much as I like Emma I have to admit that she is not as brave as she appear to be because she never is able to put face up to the problems that she find in the novel. I remember the first one when she realizes that Mr. Elton was in love to her and not Harriet; the next day she was pleased to see a lot of snow outside and thought that it was a good thing because it means she could not go to church and see Mr.Elton, or go to visit Harriet.
Scarcely did she know Mr. Knightley´s declaration when she tought it would be a good idea if Harriet went away from Highbury for a short time so they did not see each other for a few weeks.
That´s why I think she always try to scape from the problems but there is no scaping from the problems.
Marta I have repeated this remark because I think with the problems he has been on the blog you have not been able to correct and I have much interest in to know whether it is well written or not.

carol dijo...

Hi mates! I´ve had problems with the blog. It has been difficult to find the most recente message. But it has been good because I´ve been able to read an old message and I´ve had a new idea.
To start, according to Ana María, I agree about Jane and Frank aren´t evils. They are two inmature and spoiled persons who aren´t not able to feel identified with the other´s feelings, like a lot of people nowadays too. This is the reason why I like this novel because it talks about feelings and how people face up them in a universal way because, I´m sure, all of us know people who could be alike the characters.
Another point, the new idea! I´ve read an post of when Jane was ill. Do you think her illness could be a message to F.? A lot of people use thier weakness to ca catch another one. Do you agree?

Carmen Segura dijo...

Dear mates, I have just spent one hour reading your comments because I have been occupied a lot with my family problems many days.

Maria I like a lot your comments because you summariz very well what happens.
I agree with you about the letter from Frank Churcill.
Mr K analyses the letter very well.

Now, in chapter 51, Emma, after having read the letter, recognises Frank is grateful to Mrs Weston, he is repentant and he is in love, so she can not judge him severely.

Mr Knightly is always right and he criticizes Frank for his behaviour because he played a dangerous game.
Mr Knightly is always the model of all that is correct and after reading the letter he told Emma about the importance of sincerity and truth with each other.
“My Emma, does not every thing serve to prove more and more the beauty of truth and sincerity in all our dealings with each other?”

Carmen Segura dijo...

chapter 52
The novel is going to its end and all things are going to be solved.
First of all Emma pays a visit to Jane, who is welcoming, animated and pretty.
They speak warmly to each other and they forget older worries.
I think it is the beginning of a nice friendship.

But Emma has still two problems. One of them is Harriet because Emma is feeling guilty about her.
The other one is to communicate her engagement to her father. Emma does not want her father to be upset so she has to tell the news carefully.

Ana Martínez Esteban A1 S dijo...

I also agree with María and the most of you when you praise Mr. K.’s attitude connected with Frank’s letter. While disliking Frank, Mr. K. tries to pay attention to Emma’s reasons in order to excuse Frank’s mistakes. No matter how dreadful acts Frank have committed, Mr. K. not only will try to understand his mistakes but also to forget Emma’s errors so that to please Emma, his love.
On the other hand, at this time we can see that Emma has her own worries. Despite being happy, she is afraid of upsetting her father. She is restless because she does not know how he is going to take her engagement with Mr. K. Harriet is the other problem that threats Emma’s happiness now.

Isidro dijo...

I agree with all of you. Finally, Frank is forgiven, Jane is recovered, Emma and Mr Knightley are very happy loving each other. And only does Harriet’s happiness lack.
Emma paid a visit to Jane and it seems that they are going to be very good friends. But I would like to stress Mrs Elton’s irony in these words of chapter 52, or perhaps should I say sarcasm??:
“I have scarce had the pleasure of seeing you, Miss Woodhouse,- she shortly afterward began,- since the party of Box Hill. Very pleasant party. But yet I think there was something wanting. Things did not seem- that is, there seemed a little cloud upon the spirits of some.-So it appeared to me at least, but I might be mistaken. However, I think it answered so far as to tempt one to go again. What say you both to our collecting, the same party, and exploring to Box Hill again, while the fine weather lasts?- It must be the same party, you know, quite the same party, not one exception”
To me, Mrs Elton’s sarcasm is insurmountable and Emma got K.O.
Emma didn’t know how to reply, but in this moment Miss Bates’s arrival got her out of the trouble attracting everybody’s attention.

Laura de Arriba A1-S dijo...

It is supposedly a romantic novel, isn’t it? However, where is the romanticism? Don’t you think Mr. Knightley’s proposal of marrying Emma is the most unromantic passage ever written? “It was plain, unaffected, gentlemanlike English, such as Mr. Knightley used even to the woman he was in love with, how to be able to ask her to marry him (...). Emma’s answer was ready at the first word. ‘While her dear father lived, any change of condition must be impossible for her’” It is truth that matrimony is not but a contract; however, it is too much. Here there is a complete want of sentiments. From my point of view the only romanticism in the whole novel is the story of Frank Churchill and Jane Fairfax. While Emma is playing a risky game in order to fill her empty life, Frank and Jane are living a real love story: two young gays with a very different social position fall each other in love. Under the blindness and unawareness of youth and crazy love they formed a non-approved engagement that has to be concealed until Mrs. Churchill dies. There is a quarrel, a misunderstanding with letters and behaviours, another girl (Miss Woodhouse) between them, an insufferable pain that produces a great affliction to Jane, and, finally, the reconciliation and, I guess, the happy end. Without this story the book wants of any interest. Emma must think ‘I wish I were Jane’: handsome and clever enough to win the heart of a rich and good-looking man.

marta dijo...

María, I have corrected it, in knowing.., and the two Ss that you forgot in the third person. They are at the beginning of this page.The comment is good.
Carol, about F+J's not being..,could be like..,
I think her illness was produced by the anxiety of the lie, don't you?

AV1-D dijo...

Laura, I quite agree with you, this novel deficiency in romanticism, I see the same point as you that the unique romantic love is showed it is between F.Ch and J. F., on the other hand F. Ch. is the only one who speaks about the beauty, he is talking to E. about J.F.’s nice look, but in no moment in the novel Mr. K. praise E.’s beauty or whatever other woman.
I have posted a similar idea before, Marta I understand when you say the behaviour’s English people is cold in that matter, but… I think:¡ it is so much cold¡, a little passion never come bad, I think it is always walcome. People usually have strong feeling: love, hate, envy etc., that is my point of view. It is possible that Jane A. tried to get a revolutionary novel with these characters, she wanted to point out plain character, without passion, or perhaps we feel passionate because of our Latin character.
I don't know which is the correct point.

Mercedes AV1-D dijo...

I am sorry, It's me Mercedes.
I have forgotten put my name

marta dijo...

Carmen when Mr.K talks about sincerity it is true that he doesn't realise he is hiding something! And E blushes because she knows that she is hiding a lot!
Yes we hope it is going to end happily!
Isidro, and only does H lack happines, the subject only in the middle.
A very good quote I agree that he is being mean and suggesting E's love for F, it serves her right, though not the comment for a religious man to make.

Isidro dijo...

Marta, the sarcastic comment I quoted was from Mrs Elton’s not from Mr Elton’s.
Although Mrs Elton addressed at first to Mr Woodhouse because she just arrived there, saying “I have scarce had the pleasure of seeing you,………..since the party of Box Hill.”
I would like to highlight that Mrs Elton’s sarcasm was addressed to Emma and Jane, not only to Emma, as we can see in these words:
“What say you both to our collecting, the same party, and exploring to Box Hill again, while the fine weather lasts?”
In my view, Mrs Elton’s critic was ruthless. She didn’t have any reason to disguise her thought. To her, as to everyone neutral spectator, after knowing Frank and Jane’s engagement, Frank’s behaviour was very ill with both Emma and Jane, and I think that Box Hill is a very bad memory for them.
When Mr Knightley read Frank’s letter didn’t want comment the passage because he didn’t want to annoy Emma.
While Mr Knightle read this passage, Emma was worried waiting Mr Knightley comment.
Even Frank confessed that he preferred that Mrs Weston wasn’t there, because he was ashamed of his own behaviour.
So, everybody thinks the same of the value of the actions, but everyone express the own opinion differently depending on the degree of sympathy with the people judged.
For example, Mr Knightley softens his judgment in front of Emma, and Mrs Elton decides showing the highest acrimony.

marta dijo...

Laura, two young gays, means two homosexuals! That was impossible at that time it was illegal. If you mean guys, it is wrong too because it means two men also.
I have to say that you have a point, but the story is good because it shows how people lived at that time and that is important too, it is not just a love story.

marta dijo...

Mercedes, the only love shown is.., a little passion is good..,
I don't think that she wanted to show cold characters I think she showed characters as they really were. The English are cold and they control themselves, you can't think they act like us or other cultures. The novel is not particularly cold it is realistic. You must also take into account that they belong to the 19th century when people were even colder and they tended to hide feelings much more than today

marta dijo...

Isidro,waiting for.., everybody expresseS.., decides to show..,
Yes, it was a turning point for everybody and a bad memory for all, that is why,as you say, Mr.E mentioned it.
Well the Eltons will have to learn to live with E and Mr.K together.
Have you found out what I meant?

clara dijo...

Can anyone explain me how to see the comments here? I don't now why I haven't seen them since last month.

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

Clara now everything is OK in the blog and my advice is that you should write now before it put bad again.

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

Thanks Marta. I was confused about it , That´s why I repeat it because since a time the block doesn´t work properly and it is very difficult to can see what you have writen.
I hope that everything be OK in Santander and you can come back with us soon.

marta dijo...

María, why I repeated it..,
Everything is fine here,thanks.
Yes, the blog is sometimes difficult to get to, I mean the comments. Will somebody tell Clara that she has to press El más reciente until she gets here? I forgot to tell her the other day and she can't see the last comments. Here I don't have your phone numbers, ok? Thanks

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

Marta don´t worry I just wrote an e-mail to Clara because it is too late to call she and tomorrow I will not be in Madrid.

clara dijo...

I've been reading chapter 52 and I've enjoyed a lot the part when Mr k and E are talking about the new baby, and that takes them to their own feelings some years ago, whe E was thirteen he was in love with her, it is not a beautiful feeling, knowing he was much older than her?

Isidro dijo...

Laura I agree with you about the coldness of Emma and Mr Knightley love. They treat the affair as a deal where it looks as if their love shouldn’t be the most important thing. It is true that there is enough rationality in their relationship. However I have realized that Mr Knightley has become a little more inclined to adapte the rationality to the feelings. Doesn’t you?

Isidro dijo...

In my opinion, the Eltons have to learn to live with Emma and Mr Knightley together, because they will be neighbors and they will have to keep up appearences, but the new relationship will be anavoidably very cold.
Mr Elton began immediately to look for the right side of the affair. He thought that Emma’s marriage became her less proud, after achieving what she supposedly had always been looking for. As well, regarding to live in Hartfield he thought: “rather he than I” …. Ja ja ja ja !!!!! The laugh is mine!
Mrs Elton was more discomposed because she thought that Mr Knightley had been deceived. She thought that Mr Knightley would be married without love and therefore it would be a “sad business for him”. As well, she was concerned because she was found of him, and she knew that Mr Knightley’s marriage would be the end of their good intercourse.

Isidro dijo...

Laura, ...I'm sorry!!

......Don't you?

Isidro dijo...

.....Emma and Mr Nightley's love.....

marta dijo...

Clara, I'm glad you have found the place, you have to look at the number of messages at the top of the page, and I look at the first one so I know I'm on the right page.
When you talk about Mr.K being in love with E at the age of 3, you use an affirmative sentence. Is that what you wanted or you wanted to ask a question?
Do you think it is nice?

marta dijo...

Isidro, don't you?.,
I insist that the English are cold, it is how they are, you seem to be very surprised about it but...
..regarding living in Hartfield.., she was fond of him..,
Yes I agree that Mrs.E thinking that she was a favourite with Mr.K, now sees that she is not going to see so much of him. He is also the most influencial man in the neighbourhood, so they are losing something if they lose his friendship. She also dislikes E a lot and she is sorry for him as she thinks that he will not be happy with her.

Isidro dijo...

Marta, you are right: English people are cold. However there are some differences between them, because Frank doesn’t reacts as Mr Knightley does, and Harriet neither as Emma. I remember the emotion of Harriet telling Emma that Mr Martin had gone three miles round in order to bring her some walnuts.
And I think that not only do some of us - Mediterranean people- think so, because Mrs Elton believes he is not in love with Emma.

Isidro dijo...

I'm sorry......Frank doesn't react as Mr K, neither Harriet as Emma does.

Isidro dijo...

When Emma asked her father his consent to her marriage with Mr Knightley, Mr Woodhouse was chocked and he “tried earnestly to dissuade her from it”.
Never did I think that Emma’s father would put so strong opposition to Emma’s marriage with Mr Knightley. We can now understand the real meaning of Emma always rejecting the idea of being married.
Do you think that Emma would be able to marry with a different person that Mr Knightley?

Isidro dijo...

We can see clearly in chapter 53 how the effect of a bad behaviour remains in the conscience. Emma can’t speak to Mr Knightley of Harriet. She has a guilty conscience because she realized that Mr Knightley was right when he told her she shouldn’t induce her to refuse Mr Martin.
I think that it is very interesting to recall their discussion in chapter 8:
“Harriet may pick and choose. Were you, yourself, ever to marry, she is the very woman for you. And is she, at seventeen, just entering into life, just beginning to be known, to be wondered……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………….. I have always thought it a very foolish intimacy,……... though I have kept my thoughts to myself; but I know perceive that it will be a very unfortunate one for Harriet. You will puff her up with such ideas of her own beauty, and of what she has a claim to, that, in a little while, nobody within her reach will be good enough for her. Vanity working in a weak head, produces every sort of mischief………………………………………Men of sense, whatever you may chuse to say, do not want silly wives. Men of family would not be very fond of connecting themselves with a girl of such obscurity.”
I’m sorry the quotation should be a little long but I think that it is very interesting in order to show the accuracy of Mr K’s prediction and Emma’s foolish manipulation.
The result is that, in this moment, while everybody is happy, Harriet is unhappy and has a dark future. Never did Emma imagine that she would have Harriet suffer so much. Now she can’t think of Harriet without feeling remorse, and even she can’t talk of her to Mr Knightley and neither Mr Knightley because he doesn’t want to annoy her.
Emma knows now the superiority and beauty of “truth and sincerity”, but she doesn’t dare to speak openly to Mr K of this affair.
In conclusion, I think that we can say of her the same words that Mr K said of Frank:
“He has had great faults, faults of inconsideration and thoughtlessness…….. but still as he is , beyond a doubt, really attached to Miss Fairfax, and will soon, it may be hoped, have the advantage of being constantly with her, I am ready to believe his character will improve, and acquire from her’s steadiness and delicacy of principle that it wants.” (chapter 51)

Isidro dijo...

.....She has a guilty conscience because she realizes....

I’m sorry. I have the bad behaviour of writing sometimes directly in the little window of the blog. And only after publishing it, do I read my comment in the great window and I can detect better my mistakes. Therefore I often publish my correction immediately.
I do it because I don’t want waste time, but at the end the result is the contrary.

marta dijo...

Isidro, nor does H as E..,so strong an opposition..,
Well I do think that H is cold too and all of them are, except maybe for Mrs.E, and she is the vulgar one.In England the better you are, regarding socil class I mean, the colder. So if you express your feelings it is because you are not one of them. H does not belong to E's class.
I am not surprised about Mr W's reaction. He is losing his darling and of course he doesn't want any changes and that is a big one.

marta dijo...

Isidro, the passages are very interesting and it is very interesting to read them now and see his insight into the whole business. I'm glad E is suffering a little she deserves it.
You haven't spotted what I said was surprising?

Isidro dijo...

In chapter 53, I think that one of the most interesting passages is when Emma read Mr John Knightley’s letter. There we see that they don’t have any sympathy to each other. Their antipathy is previous of the announcement of the engagement, but I imagine that Henry’s interest is concerned by the side of Mr John K.
In my opinion, everyone has a different point of view depending on its interests.
I have already commented Mr Woodhouse’s opposition. He only take into account his own comfort.
Mr K said to Emma that John will be easily convinced “of our having every right that equal worth can give, to be happy together”. But his brother had obviously other point of view.
And Emma, who thought very inconvenient, to little Henry’s interests, Mr. K marriage with Miss Fairfax, now she prefers to take into account her own interest and to ignore Henry’s.
But what surprise me more is Emma’s amazing of Mr John’s ignorance of their engagement. Thus, she says:
“He had no idea of me. He seems perfectly unprepared for that.”

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

Hi Isidro I disagree with you.
I think that Mr. Woodhouse’s opposition could be justified because Emma always has said that she never was going to get marry, so, her father didn’t understand why she changes her opinion and now she wants to. That’s why her father tries to convince Emma not to marry. It is also because he thought his daughter should be consistent with what she has always said and with her own words but not only for his own comfort as you said.

Isidro dijo...

Emma got very surprised in chapter 54 when she knew that Harriet had engaged with Mr Martin. Mr K was worried about Emma’s reaction, but she told him that, though astonished, she was not unhappy.
Mr K. didn’t believe her at first because she had concealed her happiness. So, he tried to convince her of Mr Martin’s good qualities, but she insisted in which she was very satisfied and she expressed her wish of happiness to them.
Emma concealed with difficulty her happiness. We read:
“She must laugh as such a close! Such an end of the doleful disappointment of five weeks back! Such a heart- such a Harriet!
Now there would be pleasure in her returning.-Everything would be a pleasure. It would be a pleasure to Know Robert Martin.”
Who would say that Emma one day would think like this?
In my opinion, Emma is a lucky woman, because we could say of her that, at the end, the fate arranges what she spoils.

Isidro dijo...

María, I think that the great concern of Mr Woodhouse, since the beginning of the novel, is his own comfort. We have seen him very worried about the meals, about the number of people present in a dinner, about the draught of air, about the hour of the end of the party, about Isabella and Mrs Weston’s marriage because he was concerned…
But, as I recognize he is a good person, I admit that he is also interested in other’s comfort, whenever his own comfort be assured.
On the other hand, I think that Mr Woodhouse is not very interested in the logic of the arguments. Mr Woodhouse is only interested in talking about very simple things; therefore he is very fond to Mrs and Miss Bates’s matters of conversation.

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

Isidro You are right in the whole thing that you say but you will be acording with me that in this case Mr. Woodhouse has the reason in ask to Emma why she now has change her opinion. Because it is an important thing in his lives.

Ana Martínez Esteban A1 S dijo...

Reading the last chapters I see that Mr. Woodhouse is the kind of person that, though he is not able to hurt anybody, he is used to make everybody near him as his family and friends do everything according with his own preferences. His weak personality makes him to be scarcely independent to live alone in Hardfield. That’s why he doesn’t approve Emma’s engagement. It is supposed he will have living alone, or moving, or sharing his own home with Mr.K. However it is the proper nature of his flaw that makes the solution easier. He notices that not only has he to yield but also to understand the new event. Now he is in front of a great feeling as the infatuation of Emma and Mr. K. is.

Isidro dijo...

María, you are right in which Mr Woodhouse asked Emma why she had changed her opinion, but the reason of his disappointment was his fear to any change in his life.

Anónimo dijo...

l'm Amparo
In the last six chapters of the novel,it looks as if Emma had learnt to give up her love of speculation.In the same way,she appears as less imaginative.However,in contrast she has learnt to be a realist.From relishing the amusement of intrigue and mistery she has become more and more close and dear.Mr K say about her, 'this is my dear Emma'in the chapter 49

marta dijo...

Isidro, when E readS..,he only takeS..,what surpriseS..,
I think John K dislikes E a lot because he prefers women like his wife. He also sees E as a pampered girl and does not know of her wish to change.
María, to get marrieD,
Yes I agree with you no wonder he is surprised.
Isidro, had got engageD..,
Yes she is a lucky girl like Frank.
I agree with what you say about Mr.W

marta dijo...

María, you will agree with me.., is right in asking.., she has changeD, in their lives..,
Yes no wonder he asks.
Ana Mª, he is used to making.., makes him BE.., he will to live alone..
Yes but he is kind and means well he is a favourite although a bit of a pest.

marta dijo...

Amparo, Mr.K sayS of her..,
A good comment though I don't understand the part of the speculation

Mª Av1-S dijo...

I think that it is true that Mr. W. is a little selfish and maniatic with his daily routine, but also he is an old man and most old people are like that. In addition, from my point of view, he is so obsessed with health that he is hypochondriacal, and surely it should not be easy to live with him. However, when E. explains her reasons to be single, she says that she couldn’t find a man who tries her as her father does. So despite of his faults Mr. W. appears as a very kind man, a kind of gentleman that it is disappearing and who knows what should be done, like Mr. K., for instance Mr. W. says to E. how a bridge (Mrs Elton) should be treated.
It is not surprising Mr. W’s first opposition to E’s wedding , hardly does the novel start that we know his bad opinion about matrimony and we can foresee his reaction, but also we have read that E. has been able to convince him in any matter along the novel and that he always gives in to her whises.

Isidro dijo...

Maria, I agree with you. Mr Woodhouse is unquestionably a good person. But I think that Emma’s idea of finding a man who should try her as her father does is out of place, because the relationship with a husband never will be able to be the same that the relationship with a father.
I knew that Mr Woodhouse would be worried if Emma should announce him someday her intention of marrying. But I thought that his opposition wouldn’t be as strong as we have seen, in the case in which Mr Knightley should be the suitor.

marta dijo...

María, despite his faults.., who treats her as her father does.., Mr.W's opposition is not surprising..,
Isidro, who should treat her..,
I think that E's wedding is a tragedy for Mr.W, how could it be otherwise? He needs time to swallow that pill, he is old and for old people changes are terrible. He is specially unable to cope with change so I'm not surprised it was a blow, and he is a little selfish too, so....

Mercedes AV1-D dijo...

Now, we are in the end, we can see everything and everybody is in their exact place.
Mr. Wood. approves the marriage between his daughter and Mr. K. because they will be living in Harfield, and it is not necessary that little Harry's property be lost.
At last Harriet will be joining Mr. Martin and on the other hand we could know Harriet’s parentage, she is the daughter of a rich tradesman, so I say, somebody is fine.
The novel has a happy ending

marta dijo...

Mercedes, yes it has a happy ending and it is a fine novel, you know that one of my other students goes with Álvaro Pombo to do yoga, and I said to him ask Álvaro what his opinion is about the novel. Álvaro told him it was a masterpiece.
So you have read a masterpiece, you have done it you must all be very proud of having been able to read it. I have to congratulate you all.

Ana Martínez Esteban A1 S dijo...

Many events have been happening through the chapters. Finally we are assisting to a very happy end where everybody seems to get a suitable position through the corresponding attachment. I believe that J. Austen has concentrated the end in the last three chapters, in a hasty way.
In chapter 53 the engagement between Emma y Mr. K is announced in Hardfield. Mr. Woodhouse’s reactions are showed, as well Mr. K.’s brother’s. Chapter 54 is devoted to Harriet and Robert Martin’s engagement. Finally Emma gets to feel herself less guilty about Harriet. In the last chapter, Austen resolves the whole acceptance of Mr. K. by Mr. Woodhouse so that living together in Hardfiel through the rob’s episodes in Mrs. Weston’s poultry and other poultry-yards in the neighborhood. It seems that Mr. Woodhouse will be safer at his home having Mr. K. living with them.

carol dijo...

Hi mates! I haven´t written for some days, I have been very busy. But I wrote in the theatre blog but nobody wrote too.
I would like to give my opinion about your more recent comments. I agree with you about the story is cold but I think English people are like that. I had an English mate (and he is an actor so I suppose he should be more expressive) and I knew he liked me (like an actress, dot´n think bad) but he didn´t show it. Rarely did he say something to show it. Only he congratulated me once and I was the happiest person in the world because it had a lot of value. So I think being cold and not showing feelings undercontrol is the Brittish banner and more at that time.
About E. How she is growing up!!! Look her at the beginning and now, she is talking about babies!!
And Clara, I agree with you about not being beautiful that Mr. K. was in love with E. when she was so young but in XIX century it was very usual so there was not any sickly in that.

Carmen Segura dijo...

Chapter 53
Much as we disliked Emma now we can see her like Mr K does, and we can like her because she is humble - she agrees with Mr John K when he says that all the fortune of the engagement between Mr K and Emma is for Emma.

In chapter 54, Emma only wishes for her future to be humble.
What an improvement since the first chapter! Then she had a disposition to think very well of herself and now she is more attentive to other people.

The novel has a happy ending. The three couples get married happily.
At that time marriage was a social contract but in this novel all of the couples are in love so the novel is romantic.
Love is the clue.
The change in Emma happened when she fell in love. She is happy ann she is ready to say sorry and to be nice.
Love makes humans beings better.

My last impression is that I have to reread the novel because in order to be able to enjoy it more and I will notice better the clues to the intrigue in many situations.
It is a classic novel because it speaks about how we are and how we act, so it is interesting in every era.

marta dijo...

Ana Mª, I agree with you a happy ending, you've done a good summary of the last three chapters.
Carol, I am very glad that you mention how cold the English are, because I say it the whole time but people I'm afraid doubt my words.
It is very true what you say about E and her change. Isidro, you see how we all perceive that she has changed?

marta dijo...

Carmen, I am glad that you are ready to read it again! Or you could try with another of her novels, I suggest Pride and Prejudice or Persuasion, but the others are fine too.
Well and how did you like the lecture? I think it was fantastic, and you'd do very well in studying your notes because it will very helpful for the exam essay so discuss what he commented and the points he made.

Isidro dijo...

Marta, I enjoyed the conference very much. I liked the conference as a whole, but I would like to comment only some aspects because I have not much time now.
First of all, I would highlight what the lecturer told us about the importance of the look all along the novel. It is so important that it looks as if only should exist in the world what the characters see. And inside this reduced world it looks as if the focus be centered only in the first characters and their nearest relationship. Not even did we know the roadside where the characters walk. Farther away the own character nothing seems to matter but Mr Woodhouse’s horses to himself.
It is curious, I had liked that the teacher had said that Jane Austin had read Davis Hume. But even if she didn’t Know Hume’s philosophy, it is possible that the cultural ideas of her time should provide her the necessary elements to create a wonderful representation of a universe of impressions and ideas that are shown in a way that it looks as if the principle of cause didn’t govern the world. I’ll put some example in other moment.

marta dijo...

Isidro, further from the self.., should provide her with.., in another moment..,
I'm very glad you liked it, and very pleased that we filled up the assembly room because it was worth it. We now know that the author from her little world managed to create something great that we are still copying. Carlos had a point when he said that the novel was just what it was a story! And you also regarding some aspects that we talked about in class.
We have to talk about the lecture on Tuesday.

Isidro dijo...

If we lived really in a world where the phenomenons didn’t be governed by a rule, there wouldn’t causes and effects, and the relationships between the events wouldn’t be necessary.
In a world without causes and effects, we would need to try of organizing the world and of explaining the events differently. We would need to associate impressions and ideas other way, and the result would likely be surprising sometimes.
In my opinion, it is possible that Jane Austin, in the case she should have known Hume’s philosophy, should have done an ironic critic of this philosophy introducing some passages of a surprising grace and sense of humor. But in the case she hadn’t do it willfully, I think that we are legitimazed to say what we see now in the novel, because I think that any work always says more that the author intends to put in.
I remember the passage of the likeness. Mrs Weston thought that the eyebrows and eyelashes weren’t Harriet’s. Mr Knightley said that Harriet was too tall in the painting. Mr Elton said: “I never saw such a likeness in my life. And finally, Mr. Woodhouse declared: “The only thing I do not thoroughly like is, that she seems to be sitting out of doors, with only a little shawl over her shoulders, and it makes one think she must catch cold” And after Emma told him it was supposed to be summer, he said:… “It never safe to sit out doors, my dear”
So, we see here what the teacher said of the importance of the look. Mrs Weston and Mr Knightley see Harriet in the picture as a Harriet’s copy and they criticize comparing the copy to the model. Mr Elton saw all time the likeness as a work of Emma, independently of Harriet that didn’t have any interest to him. Emma tried to induce Mr Elton to pay attention on Harriet through the likeness but Mr Elton only was interested in Emma’s way of painting and in Emma herself. And finally, Mr Woodhouse saw the likeness as the true reality. To him, the likeness was very pretty, but he couldn’t bear to see Harriet in the picture catching cold.
It is not fantastic?

Isidro dijo...

A little more about the look:
The look is very important but, as the teacher said, it is necessary to know how to interpret it.
In a world with causes and effects to predict events is very easy. So, after having seen a phenomenon in a moment, you can know that another one has happened before. For example, if you see smoke in a site you know that it is because there is a fire there, but if you don’t accept the rule of cause you need to go to there in order to know what is happening, with the consequent risk.
In the novel, there is a conversation between Emma and Frank in which they speak of this matter. We read in chapter VIII:
……………………….“And then, he saved her life. Did you ever hear of that?- A water- party; and by some accident she was falling overboard. He caught her.
He did. I was there-one of the party.
Were you really? - Well- But observing nothing of course, for it seems to be a new idea to you. –If I had been there, I think I should have made some discoveries.
I dare say you would; but I, simple I, saw nothing but the fact, “……………..
So, there is an impression and the knowledge must be limited to it. To go beyond it can conduce to make mistakes, above all, if the observer is Emma.
We have imagined Frank’s look to Jane in the first ball of chapter 8, without having seen the look, while Emma, who was perfectly the look, was deceived by Frank who told her he couldn’t keep his eyes from Jane because of her hairstyle. However, Mr. Knightley knew how to interpret very well what we can imagine as a similar Frank’s look to Jane. He knew, through this look, the relationship between Frank and Jane, better than Emma after so many conversations with him.
And do you remember how Mr Knightley looked at everybody trying to discover something while the game of cards. I remember you Jane Fairfax’s reaction in this passage of chapter 41:
…………………”She was evidently displeased; looked up, and seeng herself watched, blushed more deeply than he had ever perceived her and saying only, I did not know that propers names were allowed, pushed away the letters with even an angry spirit, and looked resolved to be engaged by no other word that could be offered. Her face was averted from those who had made the attack, and turned towards her aunt”……………………………..

Isidro dijo...

................while Emma, who saw perfectily the look, was deceived.....

Isidro dijo...

Other passage where the looks played an important role is the Crown’s dance. It looks as if Jane Austin should have wanted to play with all the characters putting them out of their own place. And because of this, their looks acquire much more importance.
Emma and Frank had been looking forward the ball long time before, but Mrs Elton claimed the prominence saying that the ball had been organized in her honor, and she intended to initiate the dance accompanied with Frank Churchill. But Frank said that he had promise the first dance to Emma, therefore Mr Weston had to offer himself to accompany her. So, Mr Weston and Mrs Elton led the way, followed of Frank Churchill and Emma, who thought in the advantage of being married in order to not be relegated.
The looks of the characters during the ball revealed their true feelings. Emma was all time looking at Mr Knightley and thinking of him, who at the same time looked at her frequently.
Mrs Elton was wander around without knowing what to do, while Wrs Elton, like an intermittent traffic light, was giving him “significant glances”.
And after having Mr Elton rejected to dance with Harriet, Emma looked around and she saw Mr Elton “passing smiles of high glee” with his wife.
We can imagine Harriet’s frustration and embarrassment feeling all eyes fixed in her.
As well, we could speak too of the looks that are not described. For example, Frank would be looking at Jane all time. Otherwise Emma wouldn’t have been able to look at Mr K without Frank realized it.
We don’t know who was dancing with Jane, but, no matter who were, we can assure that she would be looking at Frank. And I am sure that Mr Knightley would have been able to perceive Emma’s and Frank’s looks and to have caught their meaning, if he had been looking at them instead of looking at Emma.
In conclusion, I would name this passage the ball of the cross looks.
I’m sorry to have been so insistent with the subject of the look. But I think that in this novel the perception is very important, because it determines the reality. In other words: although we live in the same world everyone perceives it differently. So, the world that truly exists to us is the known world, that is, the perceived world. For example: Mr Knightley world is different of Emma’s because, as the teacher said in the conference, he knows how interpret the experience and Emma doesn’t. And do you imagine how limited is Mrs Bates’s universe taking into account that she is deaf? Do you imagine how would be her universe if she also were blind?
So, we make our world with our perception, ideas, interests, beliefs, wishes, and feeling in general: love, hates, envies, jealousies, ……. And all this is the novel.
We see the effort to find a place in the world. The life is a succession of little events to most people in the world. And a beautiful, clever, rich, wealthy person can be wretch; however a person can be happy in worse conditions. It is a universal problem and everybody is concerned. Therefore this novel is still interesting today.

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

I enjoyed myself the conference because of the way that the Professor speak . I liked the way of talking and the simple with he described each character and this allowed me to better understand the background of the book we've been reading so carefully throughout the course.

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

I have just reading posted about what Alvaro Pombe said about the novel ...this novel is a masterpiece and I have to admit that when I started to read it, I thought I would not be able to read this novel but after working hard I Have to say that I got it, so I feel very happy.

marta dijo...

Isidro, another passage.., looking forward to ..the professor not teacher he is more than just a teacher.
Very interesting comments and reflections we have to continue on Tuesday or Thursday, E's day.
María, thank you for saying so it was very interesting for me too.
I'm very glad you were able to you have read a masterpiece and a novel that was the first of its kind. Now they are all like it. WELL DONE

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

Yesterday when I was in my gym class, I twisted my ankle and I am in complete rest, so I will not be able to go to class today .
I feel very bad because I am going to lose my English class especially when the course is going to finish. But I hope to can go soon to class.

Anónimo dijo...

I'm Amparo
I agree with yours, the conference has been very interesting.I have been able to discover that Emma and her world, or better said one of Austen' s best-loved novel has a lot of saying or showing us to improve our relatioship or to know like the looks have been and follow being the mirror of our's soul and a way to relationship

Mercedes AV1-D dijo...

I agree with everybody: the lecture was a success, it was very interesting and the lecturer was clear and precise in his speech.
Yes, this novel it is a masterpiece, but the most important thing is we are able to understand it because we have worked it; while we have studied charter by charter we have been able to learn a lot of different point of view not only in the characters but also in feelings, behaviour, and looks that as Isidro says it is so important in the book because through them we can guess some situations
I think if we had not worked as we have made it, we wouldn’t be able to understand and enjoyed as same way.

Reyes dijo...

I liked very much the lecture. It was a great pleasure listening to the Professor and how he analysed and explained to us the plot, the story and the characters in a very simple way to us understand it...and how he mixed and related the situation and the characters with our current era.

It is amazing ......That´s why he considers the novel as a masterpiece , because everything in it is perfectly alive in our days.

Who doesn´t meet "an Emma" or "a Mrs. Elton, Mrs. Weston around us????? Everybody is a little "Emma", because she represents the "goodness" and the "badness" of human beings, with rights and mistakes.

And all of us are looking for " a Mr. Knightly", becasue it is our nature try to find the "perfection" in ourselves and in our lives.

Reyes dijo...

Sorry ..Marta.

" because everything in it is alive in our days, perfectly".

Adj. to the end. I must rememeber it.

carol dijo...

Hi mates! What a pity! I sent a comment last Saturday but the blog wasn´t working good and it isn´t. So, I would try to remember it.
Firstly, I would like to say that I´ve enjoyed it a lot the lecture and the book. Dámaso opened new points of view to me and it was very interesting.
And now, E. is finished and it´s a pity. I´ve enjoyed the challenge of reading it a lot. At the end I am fond of her!
To conclude, I would like to thank all of you this experience of sharing our views and our English. It´s very entertaining and I´ve learned a lot from all of you.
And Marta, thank you for spending your free time working with us.
Good luck to the exam!!!

clara dijo...

Hi mates,
I wanted to thank Marta for the lecture. It has been the best way to understand the novel on the whole and at the same time to learn all its characters' personalities and their relationship with our own life nowadays. I loved it a lot.
The course is finishing and we're going to miss it in summer, we've worked a lot this year.

Isidro dijo...

The novel takes place in a time when social possition was determined by birth, because people inherited the social status. And the wealth was determined originally by the land. Other ways of wealth weren't less valued. Thus, Mrs Elton's familly was rich, but she hadn't so social steem as Mr Knightley or Emma's had, because her family's wealth came from the slave trading and Emma and Mr K's families were landowner. And the case of the Coles was similar. Do you remember the reluctance of Emma to going to their party? Do you remember her interest in showing them her disdain?
The work is considered a tragedy as we see in the case of Jane. And even Mr John Knightley seems to belong to a different world, a niew system where the work begins to be a niew value. We can see these two different views represented in this quote of chapter 13:

"I was snowed up at a friend's house once for a week. Nothing could be pleasanter. I went only for a night, and could not get away till that very day se'nnight.
Mr. John Knightley looked as if he did not comprehend the pleasure, but said only, coolly.
I cannot wish to be snowed up a week at Randalls..............................................................................................................
.....................................................................................................................................
I think you will agree with me, (turning with a soft air to Emma,) I think I shall certenly have your approbation, though Mr Knightley perhaps, from being used to the larges parties of London, may not quite enter into our feeling.
I know nothing of the larges parties of London, sir. I never dine with any body.
Indeed! (in a tone of wonder and pity,)and I had no idea that the law had been so great a slavery. Well, sir, the time must come when you will be paid for all this, when you will have little labour and great enjoiment."

Consequently, as social status was determined by birth, the marriage of the young people was an important matter, specially for women. And when J Austen decides to tell the daily life of some young people, we shouldn't be surprised of seeing that she should have put the marriage in the center of the novel, because it was one of the utmost interest of the people.
The marriage is the leitmotif of the novel. It begins just after Mrs Weston's wedding and Mr Woodhouse's regrets by it, and ends with all the main characters's marriage and with the birth of Mrs Weston' daughter. And it is curious that the novel should last the time between the gestation and the birth of the little girl. A little girl that must be marriet. Why not to one of Isabella's sons?
After a long time, today, work is an important factor of social rise, but marriage remains, as well, an important matter to the families, and sometimes it is a cause of conflicts.

clara dijo...

Isidro, your analysis is great. I agree with you; thanks to people’s inheritance of the status, it was very difficult if not impossible to shift to a better social class, as it’s the case of the Eltons, they have enough money to be able to afford a similar life as the Woodhouses and Mr knightley, but they didn’t accept them as members of their group, although they go together to parties, visits and things like that.

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

I agree with you Clara as Professor Damaso told as the the origin of the money was very important at that time. Another important thing is that Mr. Knightley ´s money comes from the land he owns but the money that Mrs. Elton posses is not very clear what is his origin.

Isidro dijo...

The professor said that in XVIII and XIX nineteen centuries reading novel was a way of education for young people. In my opinion, two kind of moral systems there are in the novel. One of them is represented by Mr Kniggtley who is the paradigm of the universal value, that is, a objective moral in the classical style. For example, in Platon truth, beauty and virtue are identified. And we see this same principle in chapter 51:
"My dear Emma, does not every thing serve to prove more and more the beauty of truth and sincerity in all our dealings with each other?"

So, the good intention of the person is the most important thing. Everybody agrees that Mr Knightley is the perfect gentleman. As the professor said, he has learned the rules and he knows the apropiate way of acting in every moment. He is a good model to be followed. However, I think that it is not only a question of knowledge, but as well a thing of good will, because it is possible that a person should act wrong knowing that she is acting wrong.

Another moral, represented chiefly by Emma, there is in the novel. It is the relativisme and utilititarisme moral. According to this view, a good behaviour is what is useful, or in other way, what produces in you a feeling of attraction or simphaty, and it is wrong what produces in you a sentiment of aversion.

To a selfish person it is very difficult to take into account different points of view of her own's. We have seen it in Emma many times in his behaviour to Harriet, to Mrs Elton, to the Coles, to Jane. The moral proposed in Emma's behaviour intends to keep up appearences.
The moral rule would be this: you must do what is better for you, whenever you must be polite. That is, you can have in view your own interest when you acts but you must acts in a way that no one can say you are a selfish person.
For example, in the case of Emma she goes to Mss Bates, after being acted very ill with her, in order to recover her self steem, but she doesn't apologize. And only was she very amable to Jane when she was ill, because she needed that everybody, and above all Mr Knightley, should think that she had acted well. But she did not took any interest with her when Mr Knightley suggested her that Jane needed help in order to her not to fell into Mrs Elton's clutches. That is: while Emma saw Jane as a rival she didn't took her into account. Only when Jane was ill and she was sunken and pitiful, did Emma manifested a real interest with her.
And Emma's behaviour with regard to Harriet was very ill, although the fate should have been kind with her at the end.
In conclusion, Emma is a selfish person who only take into account her own interest,but she knows how to conceal her real intentions.
So the implicit rule of behaviour is to take care about the appearences, it is the art of the dissimulation, of learning the apropriete gestures and tone of voice, the way of eating, etc... That is, the adecuate degree of hipocrisy in order to achieve the target of beeng accepted for the others, while you get your own interest.

In conclusion, Emma is like her father, who only allowed Emma's married, after knowing the robberies occurred in the neighbourhood, and he saw that her daughter's marriage was the better way of guarantee his security. Even Mrs Weston thought that Mr Woodhouse would have been a great inconvenient in case Frank had intended marriet Emma. She knew very well that Mr Woodhouse would put his convenience ahead of his daughter's happiness.

Isidro dijo...

I'm sorry.
..............Who only allowed Emma's marriage..............

marta dijo...

I have been absent for a few days because of the essays and because I have been away. I have read some comments and they are fine on the whole. I'm so glad you liked the lecture! It was great and I appreciate the fact that you have liked it and that you say so, thank you. It is nice to be told.

marta dijo...

Isidro, you have put, didn't took, twice!!! Careful.
You insist on E's selfishness and badness and quite honestly I can't see that she is so bad though your ideas are interesting and you try to prove your point but I can't see that E is at all like her father! Even Austen tells us clearly that she was like her mother. The problem with is that she had been given principles but she had also been spoilt.
How would Mr.K marry her if she were as you picture her? He is not a fool he sees that she is good deep down, I'm sure.

Isidro dijo...

Marta, I want you to Know that, in my case, the blog has been the most important factor of motivation and improvement. When the course began, my level, as you know, was so low that I thought I couldn't stand the pace. At first, I didn't have the minimun necessary level to follow your explanations. And, not only did I understand very little, but I couldn't participate in the conversations because I couldn't even form simple sentences. Moreover, although I have listened english frequently, my improvement in my understanding has been more slow than I would like.

However, despite not being able to work properly other aspects, the blog has helped me a lot, because I have realized that my improvement in the writing has determined also an improvement of the general learning of the languish. At first, I was very surprised of realizing that you didn't put a limit at our comments, but you encouraged us to write in it. However, I have had a little of ill conscience because the lenght of some of my comments could imply enough work for you, taking into account that you had to read and to correct everyone's comments.

So I thank you very much the oportunity you have given us of writing in the blog about Emma. With the blog you has achieved to extend your influence beyond the traditional space and time of a normal class. Through the blog, not only have you given us the oportunity of writing and correcting our mistakes at any moment, but you have opened us the door of the literature, with the cultural enrichment implied in the reading of a masterpiece.

Otherwise, you are right when you criticize my severity with Emma's behavior. In reality, the novel tells us the daily life of some young people whose problems have very little importance. These are the characteristic problems and conflicts of the last stage of the adolescence. In reality I think that there is not a bad character in the novel. For example, Mrs Elton, which is one of the most odious characters, is not guilty of belonging to a family enriched with the slave trade, and her great sin is to be too much vulgar and to try to show obsessively her wealth, as all the niew rich. And we can understand and justify Frank's behaviour, after knowing his love to Jane, because we know that the lovers do follies.

I have exagerated sometimes and others I have tried to find different views in order to extend the terms of debate, but I have intended always to remain faithful to the novel and to respect the original text.

Finally, as a joke, I'll quote the passage where Mr Elton declared his love to Emma:

" ...her hand seized- her attention demanded, and Mr Elton actually making violent love to her: availing himself of the precious opportuniy, declaring sentiments which must be already well known, hoping-fearing-adoring-ready to die if she refused him; but flattering himself that his ardent attachement and unequally love and unexampled passion could not fail of having some effect, and in sort, very much resolved on being seriously accepted as soon as possible."

Here, Mr Elton's warm behaviour breaks with the stereotype of an english man and with the caution expected of a priest. He was disappointed and frustrated and at the end of the novel he showed still his resentful.
I think that Jane Austin Shows through Mr Elton a negative view of the religion. Don't you?

My first intention was only to thank Marta her excellent work and professionalism and also to thank all of you, mates, your interesting comments. But finally, I have made another long comment. I'm sorry.

marta dijo...

Isidro, thank you for your very nice comments about the blog and myself. I appreciate that you are aware of all this and I am very happy to see how the blog has helped you and how much you praise it.
Thank you for saying what few say. I do think that the blog is very good for you. It is an opportunity to write and think in English(this time it IS in) and to be in contact out of the classroom
Thank you also, and very much too, for your comments in the blog they have been very interesting and worht reading. You have contributed a lot to it and not only me says this but everybody. I hope that next year you will continue posting and keeping us entertained!!

clara dijo...

Much as I dislike sucking up to you I have to say that I've enjoyed a lot this course, not only because of the blog, that has been great, (Marta you've done a hard work, every day, No matter how horrible our writings were, you've been there helping us, you're a great teacher)but also because your classes.
Are you going to be in adv 2 course next year? I wish you were there, but only if I pass the exam.

marta dijo...

Clara, thank you so much for saying so and for this nice post!!!You have been great too and I really enjoyed being with you. You are a fantastic group!!

marta dijo...

Mercedes what you wanted has happened so don't worry.

María. Av. 1-D dijo...

I completely agree with Clara I am delighted with this course and I think that the blog has been fantastic not only because it has helped me to understand better the book but also because the blog has been for me like an extra support to my English classes.
Thanks Marta for everything you have done for us.

Mercedes AV1-D dijo...

Hi Marta,
Thanks so much for your comment, I have got it.
I agree with Clara and Maria, you had been helping us a lot and I am looking forward to hearing from you next course and posting on a new blog.
Thanks, thanks, I really appreciate it. You are a superb teacher¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡

marta dijo...

Mercedes thank you very much, I'll be very glad if you are with me next year, you are great and participate a lot which is fantastic.

I just wanted to say to those who have asked me that I'm not going to be teaching A2 finally. For various reasons I have swaped with Carmen my A2 for her I2 so you'll be with her. You will really enjoy it. See you all the same, you know I will always be available for you and have a fantastic summer. DO SAME ENGLISH EVERY DAY PLEASE!

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Wilkie Collins

Wilkie Collins